AirBlue jet down in Islamabad

[HASSAN JAVED]

Abbas bhai that PIA flight was PK 356 from lahore and it landed at Islamabad Airport.............

[Boomin Bomber IJ]

Dear Abbas Sb,

I am neither trying to belittle your good analysis, nor am I trying to pass verdict; all I want to show you is there is a possible different scenario for everything, so we cannot rule out anything at this juncture.

Although sabotage and attempted hijacking will also be considered by team investigating AirBlue accident according to news reports. But apparently eye witnesses’ statements recorded by various news channels/newspapers did not see any thing like aircraft exploding in the air. The sound of impact was heard only when the aircraft crashed into Margalla Hills.

I agree, sabotage seems unlikely.

As far as possibility of attempted hijacking is concerned, till last communication between pilot and ATC reported in media there’s no indication/signal of any hijacking attempt.

What if the old captain himself got a funny idea in his head? With all these suicide bombings going on in the name of Islam, it has become a bit difficult to trust anyone completely, especially the Mullah types.

Again, let me reiterate I am NOT SAYING HE WAS DOING IT, I am just saying it can only be ruled out after a thorough and honest investigation

Reports in media claim that red zone area in Islamabad where important buildings like parliament house, prime minister house, president house etc. are situated, that area is restricted or ‘no fly zone’. Is it true that this ‘no fly zone’ area is for all types of aircraft ? If yes, then how’s this ‘no fly zone’ enforced by air traffic controllers and what sort of defensive measures are adopted to prevent aircraft entering this ‘no fly zone’. I don’t think any type of anti-aircraft equipment is intalled in that red zone (no fly zone) area and apparently combat aircraft from nearest air bases like Kamra and Peshawar will take some minutes to reach and intercept an aircraft entering that 'no fly zone' area of Islamabad.

Some reports claim that the ill-fated aircraft entered this ‘no fly zone’ while some statements say the aircraft did not enter this ‘no fly zone’ area. Whether ill-fated AirBlue aircraft entered that ‘no fly zone’ area or not, in both cases apparently it did not play any role in aircraft crashing into Margalla Hills.

I am not sure if any interceptors are stationed at Chaklala, but SAMs don't need to be launched from Kamra or Peshawar! Even a scramble from Chaklala would be too late!

It will be useful to know the height at which the aircraft made an impact with Margalla Hills. Witnesses claim that they saw the ill-fated aircraft flying very slow and just seconds before its collision with Margalla Hills there was sudden increase in engines’ noise. This probably indicates that pilots saw hills dangerously close to the aircraft at that moment or got warning from Ground Proximity Warning System (GPWS) but it was too late to take evasive action. Landing gear was also down at the time of crash. The lowered landing gear might also have hindered attempt to climb and avoid collision with Margalla Hills.

Question is: What was the aircraft doing so dangerously close to the hills? Any pilot as experienced as our unfortunate Captain would have a fairly accurate idea of his bearings just from the direction and time flown, even if he was blinded by the cloud cover.

According to a report in July 29, 2010 edition of English daily ‘DAWN’, the aircraft should have made left turn roughly over Faizabad Interchange for landing on runway 12, instead of continuing flying in the direction of Margalla Hills.

Sources privy to the probe said that after the air traffic controllers noted that the pilot of ED202 was going for an unusual ‘wider approach’ beyond the allowed course and had failed to take the final ‘base turn’ towards left, approximately over Faizabad interchange,

Source: DAWN

ATC would have warned shortly after the aircaft failed to take the routine left turn after Faizabad... ample time for the pilot to take corrective measures unless he was too arrogant to take ATC warning seriously. Again, it is highly unlikely the pilot did not know where he was heading! As we have been told the skipper replied, "runway in sight," he was definitely below the cloud base. How then he could not see the base of the hills, which would anyway be nearer to him than the spot he crashed?

Here’s satellite image of Rawalpindi, I’ve indicated location of Faizabad Interchange, position of runway 12 and approximate location of aircraft crash site indicated on the web.



Some reports claim, that some wreckage of the aircraft fell in Margalla Hills area which is difficult to gain access probably the black box being searched for is among pieces of wreckage in that area. Poor weather, heavy rains are hampering aircraft wreckage search/recovery efforts according to news reports.

Hmmn... The crash site is dangerously close to the presidential enclave!

Anyhow, as many of you have criticised, we should not jump to conclusions; however, with a rich history of never being informed about the facts, it is only natural for an intelligent mind to speculate!

Regrets if I have hurt anybody's feelings!
BB

[Boomin Bomber IJ]

Can you see PIA Kabul 737 diverted to Lahore from Kabul instead of Islamabad due to "BAD WEATHER"

I got copy of see here is

According to report published in July 30 edition of English daily 'DAWN', the PIA Boeing 737 did not make emergency landing in Lahore. It was diverted to Lahore due to bad weather in Islamabad.

One news report claims the windscreen was cracked but a news report published in July 30 edition of English daily 'The News' says that some scratches were found on the windscreen of the aircraft at Lahore Airport and these were to be cleared before aircraft's next flight.

Bird strikes, malfunctioning or incorrectly set internal heating system are given as two main reasons for aircraft getting their windshield cracked.

Anyway, I think cracked and scratched windshield does not pose serious threat to safety of a flying aircraft and it can land safely.

Abbas

AirBlue A321 and all pilot and ATC right NO wrong NO problem there NOTHING DO wrong with AirBlue, A321, pilot and ATC.

IT ONLY "BAD WEATHER"

YES or NO have you see any full cloud, any rain, any wind in Islamabad last Wednesday 28 July 2010.

My flight was delayed to Lahore and Bangkok by BAD weather YES YES YES

It NOT one AirBlue. It many lots of major other many airline got BIG problem delay diverted and stranded many airport during bad weather.

ATC and AirBlue and Captain and First officer and Weather control officer and Govt and Radar and Police DID NOT know problem weather condition in ISLAMABAD and it HAPPEN and UNLUCK accident crashed into hill too late.

Umar,

I seem to have a knack for making enemies and Abbas is going to kick me out pretty soon!

Honestly, your level of English seems to betray you. Are you really a commercial pilot? Your analyses seem to have neither head nor tail! Why are you sitting in the cockpit without a uniform??? Even I can have a picture like that!

Sorry, but I had to say it!

[Huraiz]

Honestly, your level of English seems to betray you. Are you really a commercial pilot? Your analyses seem to have neither head nor tail! Why are you sitting in the cockpit without a uniform??? Even I can have a picture like that!

Sorry, but I had to say it!

Brother if you read his posts in this thread again then you'll notice that he has given a hint about his medical condition.I dont know much but he uses some sort of writing aid to post his messages and I believe everyone will agree that he is the most humble member on this forum and very well informed too...

[riz]

well yes .. he did write something about the "writing aid" some time ago. but one thing sitting on a commanders seat without uniform.. that doesnt looks good (even if he is retired).

[A300before]

I dont think he has ever claimed of being a pilot considering his disability, insensitive people.

DawnnewsTV did coverage on F/A Sapna yesterday, she was 26 and from Christian community of Wah, surprisingly Airblue havent mentioned her, even if she was off duty being a staff member she and Javeria should have been acknowledged as crew.

There was no heavy rain or fog at the time of crash, only low clouds and light drizzle.

[PIAinORD]

Umar,

I seem to have a knack for making enemies and Abbas is going to kick me out pretty soon!

Honestly, your level of English seems to betray you. Are you really a commercial pilot? Your analyses seem to have neither head nor tail! Why are you sitting in the cockpit without a uniform??? Even I can have a picture like that!

Sorry, but I had to say it!

Who the heck are you? Umar has a medical disability and needs help to post on this forum. Its easy for one to be a tough guy on the internet when one doesn't have to worry about any kind of repercussion. People who have been frequenting the forum for a while have never had a problem with Umar and I personally find his perseverance to enjoy what he loves despite his disability quite admirable. I think an apology is in order here.

I haven't posted in a while but this angered me. I am really upset about this tragedy and am praying for all those impacted...

[SalamPaks]

Can you see PIA Kabul 737 diverted to Lahore from Kabul instead of Islamabad due to "BAD WEATHER"

I got copy of see here is

According to report published in July 30 edition of English daily 'DAWN', the PIA Boeing 737 did not make emergency landing in Lahore. It was diverted to Lahore due to bad weather in Islamabad.

One news report claims the windscreen was cracked but a news report published in July 30 edition of English daily 'The News' says that some scratches were found on the windscreen of the aircraft at Lahore Airport and these were to be cleared before aircraft's next flight.

Bird strikes, malfunctioning or incorrectly set internal heating system are given as two main reasons for aircraft getting their windshield cracked.

Anyway, I think cracked and scratched windshield does not pose serious threat to safety of a flying aircraft and it can land safely.

Abbas

AirBlue A321 and all pilot and ATC right NO wrong NO problem there NOTHING DO wrong with AirBlue, A321, pilot and ATC.

IT ONLY "BAD WEATHER"

YES or NO have you see any full cloud, any rain, any wind in Islamabad last Wednesday 28 July 2010.

My flight was delayed to Lahore and Bangkok by BAD weather YES YES YES

It NOT one AirBlue. It many lots of major other many airline got BIG problem delay diverted and stranded many airport during bad weather.

ATC and AirBlue and Captain and First officer and Weather control officer and Govt and Radar and Police DID NOT know problem weather condition in ISLAMABAD and it HAPPEN and UNLUCK accident crashed into hill too late.

Umar,

I seem to have a knack for making enemies and Abbas is going to kick me out pretty soon!

Honestly, your level of English seems to betray you. Are you really a commercial pilot? Your analyses seem to have neither head nor tail! Why are you sitting in the cockpit without a uniform??? Even I can have a picture like that!

Sorry, but I had to say it!

If you are unaware of forum member Umar744's disability, then it is hoped the above indiscretion has taught you a lesson. If you were aware of his disability, I hope you will issue an apology to Umar, who is more of a gentleman than you will ever be.

[umar744]

yes or no do you know many airrcraft have been diverted to other airport Karachi or Lahore or Peshawar or Delhi or Dubai or Muscat from Islamabad many times
Islamabad airport always big problem delay over bad weather many times
1)fog
2)thunderstorm
3)heavy rain
NOW today Air Traffic Control and AirBlue and CAA and ISB airport and everybody LEARN lesson EXPERIENCE of AirBlue crashed and they get EXTRA lookafter takecare carefully. NO-ONE can help assist anymore.
I REMEMBER I was STRANDED in Islamabad airport for 17 hours due to bad weather then Captain Tariq Majeed (now Qatar 777)ex-PIA 777 drove his car with me from his house Islamabad to Lahore to Capt.Tariq Majeed's parent's house in Model Town in 2005 and next day Capt. Tariq Majeed and me flew PIA AP-BGK from Lahore to Manchester when APBGK diverted to Lahore on route from Karachi to Islamabad.
YES or NO do you KNOW SEALEVEL is 1,700feet high ground in Islamabad. all pilot must turn switch from zero to 1,700feet on ALT Feet machine in cockpit and all pilot aware remember all mountain hill 3,000 to 4,000 feet sealevel MUST fly MINIMUM 5,000 feet
Your Forum "Disabled" me YES it's DDA=Disabled Discrimination Act but Equal Opportunites but all you and everyone and me are "BUSINESS and FRIENDLY"
IF you DO NOT know or believe any problem many times in Islamabad and Lahore many times then up to you like. IT same ALL world have problem. Better Pray God and lookafter and take care yourself and everyone and myself happy smile I have NO problem myself.
Capt. Pervaiz Iqbal Chaudhry did NOT inform tell let his real cousin Capt. Nayyar Iqbal PIA 777 and Qamar Malik deaf about Capt. Pervaiz Iqbal Chaudhry joined AirBlue and moved from Lahore to Karachi.
Have nice day
Happy smile
Best wishes and kindest regards

[TAILWIND]

What if the old captain himself got a funny idea in his head? With all these suicide bombings going on in the name of Islam, it has become a bit difficult to trust anyone completely, especially the Mullah types.

In my opinion its being very insensitive to the extent of being cruel to the crew especially captain of the flight to suggest or suspect any such thing pury because he was a bearded person with mehrab on his foredead. With no other evidence pointing in that direction, just the face of pilot compells people to make such weird accusations. This was even suggested by a Urdu Daily columnist i.e a kamekazi type of mission towards Presidency or the US Embassy.
Had he been a clean shaven person or one with a stylish french cut and gelled hair with designer glasses no one would have pointed to that direction.
Very Sad

[Abbas Ali]

Umar,

I seem to have a knack for making enemies and Abbas is going to kick me out pretty soon!

Honestly, your level of English seems to betray you.

For your information Umar has been fighting against Usher syndrome and that's why his message posting style is different. But I appreciate Umar's passion for aviation.

Why are you sitting in the cockpit without a uniform??? Even I can have a picture like that!

Sorry, but I had to say it!

You really don't need to make such comments.

So, kindly keep your posts related to topic subject.

Abbas

[irfan khan]

Source: http://dailypak.com

[Abbas Ali]

DawnnewsTV did coverage on F/A Sapna yesterday, she was 26 and from Christian community of Wah, surprisingly Airblue havent mentioned her, even if she was off duty being a staff member she and Javeria should have been acknowledged as crew.

There's also name of another flight attendant Aisha Arif mentioned in news report quoted below probably she also was an off-duty employee of the airline aboard the ill-fated aircraft.

Apparently the four on-duty cabin crew members were Umm-e-Habiba, Hina Usman, Shazia Razzaq and Naheed Bhatti.

The bodies included those of Airblue’s cabin crew Naheed Bhatti, Hina Usman, Umme Habiba and Aisha Arif,

Source: The News

Abbas

[Abbas Ali]

There was no heavy rain or fog at the time of crash, only low clouds and light drizzle.

On the day of AirBlue accident i.e. July 28 in live video reports aired by local news channels within hours of the accident different views of Margalla Hills and crash site were shown. At some places Margalla Hills were very clearly visible but some video shots showed low clouds/fog covering the hills.

The AirBlue Airbus A321 (AP-BJB) was flying at height of 1000 feet when it crashed into Margalla Hills, according to statement by AirBlue CEO Shahid Khaqan Abbasi.

I think the aircraft crashed into Margalla Hills where they were under the cover of clouds/fog/mist.

But seems like visibility in the area around Islamabad Airport at the time of incident was good enough for flight operations i.e. within designated area for flight operations and that's why airport was open for flight operations at that time.

Looks like the AirBlue A321 flight drifted into area towards Margalla Hills where visibility was poor due to low clouds/fog/mist.

Here are video stills showing different visibility conditions on different sides of Maragalla Hills on the day of accident.


Margalla Hills clearly viewed from here. Smoke rising from pieces of wreckage. Main wreckage most probably on other side of the hill where I believe the aircraft made impact with the hill. In background the visibility looks poor due to low cloud/fog.


A helicopter taking part in search/rescue mission at Margallah Hills crash site on July 28. In this video still, portion of Margalla hills appear under the cover of clouds/fog/mist. This video appeared on news channel at 11:25AM, the aircraft had crashed around 9:45AM.


A helicopter taking part in search/rescue mission at Margallah Hills crash site on July 28. In this video still also, portion of Margalla hills appear under the cover of clouds/fog/mist.

Abbas

[nopy99]

Has the FDR been recovered yet? I dread to think that it will not be recovered due to the looting that was reported in the media.